In this interview conducted by Bola Adewara at her Ikeja home, Gloria Junior, the second child of Steve Rhodes speaks on her father, the formation and metamorphosis of Steve Rhodes Voices and other issues.

What was it like growing up with him?
From a very early age I knew that he is a musician. My very early years were in Europe but when we came to Nigeria , he worked both in radio and television. He left home in the morning and returned when the station closed late in the night. So he was not a visible person at home because of his work. But music was part of our lives. He was always organising shows, and was involved with so many musicians.

How did he get you involved in Steve Rhodes Voices?
What happened was that my Aunt, Olga, who is my father's eldest sister, (he has two of them) traveled abroad and heard of the group called The Edwin Hawkins Singers. On her return home she brought the record home and told daddy that she believed he could do something like this and that was how it started. We would come at weekends and learn songs in his sitting room. This was early1970, I was 17 years old and just out of secondary school.

The provost of the Anglican Church at that time, The Very Reverend Sope Johnson heard about us and spoke with Daddy about the problems they had with keeping the young people in Church. He thought if more conpemporary music like ours was played in the church, it would help in keeping the young ones there. We were asked to come and perform in the church. We went and did a New Year service at the Cathedral Church of Christ, Marina Lagos. Because the reception was so good we decided to keep on at it and make it bigger.

The first members were: Bass - Tunde Lawrence, Bill Hague (a Britain), who had lived in Nigeria for many years, Tenor- Femi Adeniyi-Williams, Dayo Ogunro, Contralto - Arabang Raditapule (a Lesotho National), who was a medical student at LUTH but went on to become her country's minister for health, Veronica Jantjie (a South African), and myself , Soprano - Olga Miller (my fathers sister), my sister Jeanette, and Julie Lawrence (a German).

We would rehearse regularly. People would come after work for rehearsals from 6:00pm to 9:pm and then go home. We can't do that now because there is so much traffic and fear of robbers. It was safe then.

That was how it started and we went on to do a programme at NTA then came concerts at Easter and Christmas. Gradually the membership began to grow as people saw us and asked to be members.

Being amateur singers what was the training like?
Generally speaking, to be a member of Steve Rhodes Voices, first of all you had to be able to sing and sing in parts, (harmonise). Though we were non-professionals, we were expected to sing like professionals. The person we were working with is a perfectionist and would settle for nothing less. He would teach us a song and we would have to go over and over it until we got it right. It was not just about singing in parts but also about diction, how to use your breath, etc. It was very thorough. Anybody who had been a part of the Voices would not have had any problem if they went on to be a professional singer or musician. He taught us all sorts of things you would usually take for granted.

What was the cooperation like in a voluntary organisation like that? What was human relations like?
In all honesty, things changed over the years for so many reasons. When it started, everybody was committed because they loved to sing, loved what they were doing. Though it was voluntary, a hobby, people did not joke about it. Even at our busy moments in the office, we would call one another to sing a part if we had forgotten. Of course, the telephones worked then.

But now, the attitude has changed because of the pressures people face daily and the significance of money in today's world. The Steve Rhodes Voices is not about making money and so the expectations are very different. In fact, whatever money we made in the early days, we made it ourselves and not through sponsorship. We used to have cake fares, yard sales, concerts, etc. We had costumes designed and made by Nigerians to reflect where we come from. These days, the commitment is not there but this is not only in the area of music alone. In Nigeria today, you can't plan because there are so many things on your mind and leisure is not one of them.

Would you say Steve Rhodes made money?
He never made any money. Never, never made any money from the Voices, his main satisfaction was in doing what he enjoyed doing and doing it well. So many people never have this benefit even if they make money from what they are doling. And the result of it is that Steve Rhodes has lived longer than so many of his contemporaries. He did and is still doing what he enjoys doing. Also, he does not compromise his standard.

Steve Rhodes Voices was not about making money. It was about proving the point that this could be done in Nigeria by Nigerians and that it could be done properly and professionally by non-professionals. It was about raising the bar, setting standard.

I can boastful say that it was after The Steve Rhodes Voices that it became respectable to be part of Chorals groups. Suddenly, choirs began to spring up all over the place, and before we knew it choir began to spring up in churches also because we proved that it could be done. It became acceptable and respectable. Someone had actually said to me once that ladies who come on stage to sing in his opinion, were prostitutes. That was the kind of stigma we coped with in those days.

I think Steve Rhodes has accepted that we all come here for a purpose. We don't just come here and wander away. He has accepted that his role is to create a platform for others. To open the door so that being a musician is no longer looked down on. In those days, when children told their parents that they wanted to be musicians, the answer was, you will be a lawyer, doctor etc. But today, that is not so much the case because of the sacrifice people like Steve Rhodes made in order to make it acceptable.

He has not made money, nor has he been accorded his full respect by fellow musicians, his country men, the government. That is my personal opinion. He has brought reputation to his country. Anywhere else, he would have been celebrated but in Nigeria , we have a tendency not to celebrate our heroes or do so long after they have died. The only organisations that have acknowledged him have been PMAN and the AMEN Award.

The very first media report on Steve Rhodes Voices was captioned “Steve Rhodes takes pop music to the Church”. How ‘popish' were your songs and performance that day?
I'm sure what the reports was trying to say was that the songs were rather contemporary. You couldn't actually categorise it as pop because the root of what we did in the beginning was gospel. The vocal harmonies were unique to us but the feel of the music was essentially gospel. It was not pop music per se.

But do you listen to what we call gospel music as we play it in Nigeria today?
Like most things here, people tend to take a word and use it out of context. Gospel is a genre of music that has its own definite form. But here, when you say ‘gospel', you refer to music that has a religious bias. When people say Nigerians have their own language, they are right. Here we take a word and give it a distinct meaning as opposed to what it means universally. So gospel music here is any music that has a religious bias.

Quite frankly, I don't have any problem with what we do here. Take the Good Women's Choir for example; I don't think there is anything wrong with what they are doing based on what we call gospel music here.

Its unique, it's Nigerian, it's distinctively Yoruba. It gets to the people that it's meant for.

When Steve Rhodes Voice started, was it meant to be a gospel affair?
No. no. When it started, it was meant to be a pastime, a hobby, a challenge. We were asked to come to church to sing and it was the reaction of the congregation that led us on. Though the songs we sang at the Cathedral were Christian songs as we went on to do public shows, the repertoire grew. We began to have a Nigerian section, an African section and an International section. We began to sing songs from all over the world.

For instance, Steve Rhodes took songs like “ Heaven Helps Us All”, a song recorded by Stevie Wonder and harmonised it for the Voices. It was refreshing and unique and we were asked by people for more.

And how did you get shows or invitations?
For a very long time, we used to organise our shows ourselves. When we decided to go to Eisteddfod and represent Nigeria , upon our return the Federal Government then asked us to go to Addis Ababa to perform for the Ethiopian head of State, Haile Sellasie's 80th birthday. We had invitations to perform for various occaisions and in the 1990s people began to invite us to sing at functions. In the early days, at Christmastime, we would get together and drive to people's homes and sing for them, do three or four songs and go on to another place. It was fun and helped to set the tone for Christmas before we then would have a proper concert that people would come to.

Looking at you as a mixed blood, one would be surprised that you know so much about Nigerian cultural affairs. Tell me about your sense of belonging and appreciation of Nigerian culture.

Well, I am a Nigerian, though my mother is German. I was brought here having come back to Nigeria when I was five and I've been here all my life. The only time I was away was when I went to read education and qualified as a teacher and that was only for three years. All my education was between Lagos and Ibadan . My mother came with us but left when I was 9.

I am the child of a man who is proud to be a Nigerian. As children, he took us all over Nigeria by road and we saw different places in the East, North and West. Those days, there use to be Government Rest House so we lodged there overnight. I got to see a lot of Nigeria very early.

Now because I am a child of a man who believes so much in his country, he has instilled that same pride in me. I am a Nigerian, this is my country and that is not debatable. I carry the green passport. I regret that I can't speak all the languages of the country but I can speak Yoruba (not well but at least I can't be cheated in the market!). I am lucky that I have a friend in Bisade Ologunde, whom I call on when I need to understand things about the language.

Generally speaking, the things that make us unique are being lost but they are very important to me. I can't live anywhere else. I was born a Nigerian. As a Christian, I also believe that God put me here and this is where I belong. I have seen the greatness in our diversity and can't understand why we have a hard time accepting who we are.

Looking at you, your complexion and the daughter of whom you are, one can imagine the challenges you would have had to cope with from men who would have been after you…

To be honest with you, I did not have any problems. Somebody once told me that I did not have the kind of problem girls of my complexion had because I was Steve Rhodes daughter. People were afraid of him. I went to a boarding school, which was an all girls' school. I was a bit of a tomboy they say because I was raised by a man. Though I had my share of teenage love, heartbreaks etc, but there was nothing much about my life because of my complexion. My life was just as normal as that of any well brought up girl.

Now let's talk Steve Rhodes. Who is he?
When people ask me that kind of question, I'm not sure what kind of answer they expect from me. Steve Rhodes is a father, my father, a strict father perhaps more strict with us because we were girls, and because of the nature of his job and may be because our mother was not there. He was very strict with us when we were younger like any other father would be. I have a pretty close relationship with my dad and I can gist with him about anything. There are no limitations. Some of his traits have rubbed off on me, I am an organised person and tend to set high standards for myself.

How was life without a mother figure in the house?
I cannot honestly say I missed anything. I have thought about this for a long time. I don't know what to compare it with because there is nothing that my father did not discuss with us, whether it was boyfriend, menstruation, issues that are considered to be technically a woman's duties. I really don't know what I missed because my father was there all through.

Are you in touch with her today?
Not really. I cannot say I am. My sister Jeanette is.

Are you angry that she left?
I don't have any anger in me. In retrospect and now that I am older, and because I work with children and I appreciate how adults can affect children, in all honesty I appreciate the fact that my parents agreed to separate when they realised they could no longer stay together. It would have been a very unhealthy atmosphere and we would have been brought up with a warped idea of what marriage is all about. I am grateful for that. It was not a bitter affair where they don't talk to each other. Even at my dad's 80th birthday, video messages came from the family in Germany .

The Steve Rhodes Junior Voices, how did it happen?
D uring the staging of the production of Ijapa, a folk tale in Yoruba mythology which my father decided to set to music, we needed children to take part in some of the scenes and members of Steve Rhodes Voices were asked to bring their children. The children enjoyed themselves so much and so the Junior Voices started. It was not such a serious thing but it went on. After that the Intermediate Voices started which was made up of secondary school students.

The Steve Rhodes Orchestra is reigning now. What has happened to Steve Rhode Voices?
Well, it does not exist the way it used to. If you require the Steve Rhodes Voices, we know what to do to put something together. Steve Rhodes Voices exists, but not the way people knew it. It is different from the Steve Rhodes Orchestra.

Tell me about the Steve Rhodes Orchestra, how did it start?
I think that was in 2002 when daddy was very ill and had gone away for treatment. He was away for quite a while and in that time I sent him an email that I wanted to put on a concert and wanted a big band sound. It was my own way of getting his mind off his illness and what back on to what he loves doing. I told him I wanted the concert to come up on October 1st. He came back but it did not happen then we shifted it to December. The concert took place and we had I think about 9 and the combo. It was a wonderful opportunity for the orchestra to start, to help musicians learn about and play in a big band.

If you remember, highlife in the 1960's was big band, with horns and arrangements written in the big band style.

It was also a wonderful opportunity for people like Ayo Bankole and Sam Ukwua to write arrangements for a big band sound. Things like this don't usually happen and it just grew from there.

We have had a lot of people pass through the orchestra. Sometimes it has been 19 horns, sometimes 26 made up of trumpets, alto & tenor saxophones, fugal horns and so on. It really depends on which musicians are interested at any given time.

The main reason for the orchestra is to provide young musicians a chance for them to grow into more disciplined musician, and to learn and play a variety of more music forms – hilife, jazz, etc.

We do have people who have been with us from the beginning like Baba Ani who plays with Egypt 80. He comes from a discipline background, having played with Fela Anikulapo-Kuti (Ransome-Kuti) from the days of Koola Lobitos. They were a tight band because their leader was a disciplined and trained musician.